Jim / Brett,

=20

Thanks for the responses to my question.  This afternoon I went to the
warehouse that=92s holding our household goods pending the building of =
our
retirement home in Lockhart.  To make a long story short, I found the
Vertical Seismometer way back in a corner.  I=92ll try to get back there =
(I=92ll
have to get some hired muscle to move boxes since I=92m recovering from =
a
re-build (cadaver bone, 8 screws and 4 plates) surgery to my knee) and =
take
a picture of the gizmo, or take it apart for detailed pictures.  It may =
take
me a week or two to get them. =20

To give a general idea of what it looks like; picture two =BD=94 thick =
tubular
magnets shoved inside of a 8=94 piece of 5/8=94 I.D. PVC.   To force =
them
together, I cut the length of the PVC tube so that when end caps were =
glued
in place the magnets were shoved together, with only a slim (.001=94) =
shim of
Teflon holding them apart.  Before gluing on the end caps I placed a =
coil
form with an I.D. of 5/8=94 .  The coil form was wrapped with as many =
turns of
AWG #36 as I could put on the form.  Then, I located the midpoint of the
magnet assembly at the midpoint of the coil.  Picture a donut sliding =
along
a broomstick.=20

As I mentioned, I was just playing around when the idea came to me.  For
those who aren=92t familiar with Cow Magnets, farmers make their cows =
swallow
them so that any metal they ingest while grazing will stick to the =
magnets
and not perforate their innards.  Here=92s a link to the kind of Cow =
Magnets I
used: http://www.magnetsource.com/Solutions_Pages/cowmagsAlnicoPill.html

=20

Best regards,

Mike

=20

From: psnlist-request@.............. =
[mailto:psnlist-request@...............
On Behalf Of Jim and Connie Lehman
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 4:47 PM
To: psnlist@..............
Subject: Fw: Faraday's Law

=20

=20

----- Original Message -----=20

From: Jim and Connie Lehman  =20

To: psn-l@.................

Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 11:00 AM

Subject: Re: Faraday's Law

=20

Mike--an interesting question.  N & S poles spaced apart create a strong
straight geometry of lines of force between them.  N to N spaced apart =
would
show a "squished" field with lines of force leaving and bending =
backward.  A
coil placed in a N to N setting would show some output, but nothing like =
the
N to S.

  Bear in mind, lines of force are fictitious but you get an idea of =
their
presence by placing a glass plate over N to S spaced closely, and =
sprinkling
iron filings over the area.  Do likewise with N to N, and you will see a =
big
difference.

   In the typical Lehman coil/magnet arrangement the ideal is to place =
half
the pickup coil in the magnetic N to S gap so that the wires in that =
part of
the coil are perpendicular to the strong field lines.  Then any movement =
of
coil or magnet will induce a current output from the coil.

Keep up the good work-Jim

----- Original Message -----=20

From: Mike Lozano  =20

To: psn-l@.................

Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 7:43 PM

Subject: RE: Faraday's Law

=20

Hi everyone,

=20

Here=92s a question I=92ve always wanted to ask:  Why (if the number of =
magnetic
lines of force cut per unit time produces a current flow) is it not =
possible
to force two identical magnets together so that they=92re oriented (for
example) N pole to N pole.  It seems to me that the lines of force would
crowd together so that the least movement of them would produce quite a
strong response in a coil.=20

=20

I built a simple vertical seismometer with a 5 pound plumber=92s lead as =
the
weight, a spring and two cow magnets forced together in a tube of PVC so
that the resting position in the coil was the point at which the maximum
lines of force resided.  It made a lot of sense when I designed it but I
didn=92t have a good environment in which to test it; e.g. A 500 foot TV
station antenna within 50 feet; an expressway two blocks away and a =
location
inside a TV studio.  To be sure, it was a short period sensor. =20

=20

I=92m not a seismologist (that should be quite evident) =85 I=92m a =
retired
electrical engineer who specialized in grounding and lightning damage =
risk
mitigation.  In case you=92re wondering about the TV station stuff, I =
made my
living as a Meteorologist (my 2nd degree).  If my idea is dumb please =
excuse
me =96 I was just very curious about this and thought I=92d write and =
ask.

=20

Miguel Lozano

Lockhart, TX, USA

=20

From: psn-l-request@.............. [mailto:psn-l-request@............... =
On
Behalf Of Ted Channel
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 9:36 AM
To: psn
Subject: Faraday's Law

=20

Hi Folks,  I have used a simple tubular coil and ring magnet assm. in a
number of sensors.   Yet I still have unanswered questions about =
Faraday's
Law.

=20

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/electric/farlaw.html   I have
never taken the time to test all the configurations, but now is a good =
time.
Before I begin I wanted to ask someone, who understand it or who =
actually
has done these tests.

=20

Here are my questions...............Looking at this wed page, there is a
simple, tubular coil.   The illustration shows only one pole of the =
magnet
entering the coil.   The formula and examples I believe I understand.
However What happens, when both poles are inside the coil, say a small =
ring
magnet 1/4" thick.   Now things are not clear.   Is there a cancelling
effect?    With both north and south poles inside the coil, I would =
think
this would be the case.    To keep this understandable, let's not =
consider
any magnets on the outside of the coil.

=20

I see these possibilities. =20

1 One pole entering the coil, as shown, when it move in one direction it
produces + voltage, when it move in the opposite direction, - voltage.  =
This
is the only arrangement I have used.

2. Both poles inside the coil, when it move in one direction.........?
When it moves in the opposite direction....?

3. Two magnets, one entering and one exiting, with like poles facing =
each
other.   When they move, at the same time, in one direction..........?  =
When
they move, at the same time, in the other direction?

4.  Two magnets, one entering and one exiting, with opposite poles =
facing
each other.  When they move, at the same time, in one direction....?  =
When
they move, at the same time, in the other direction?

=20

I am going to run this simple test........but would like someone to =
explain,
before,  what I should see.

=20

Thanks,

Ted














Jim / Brett,

 

Thanks for the responses to my question.=A0 This =
afternoon I went
to the warehouse that’s holding our household goods pending the =
building
of our retirement home in Lockhart.=A0 To make a long story short, I =
found the
Vertical Seismometer way back in a corner.=A0 I’ll try to get back =
there (I’ll
have to get some hired muscle to move boxes since I’m recovering =
from a
re-build (cadaver bone, 8 screws and 4 plates) surgery to my knee) and =
take a
picture of the gizmo, or take it apart for detailed pictures.=A0 It may =
take me a
week or two to get them.=A0 

To give a general idea of what it looks like; picture two =
=BD”
thick tubular magnets shoved inside of a 8” piece of 5/8” =
I.D.
PVC.=A0=A0 To force them together, I cut the length of the PVC tube so =
that when
end caps were glued in place the magnets were shoved together, with only =
a slim
(.001”) shim of Teflon holding them apart.=A0 Before gluing on the =
end caps
I placed a coil form with an I.D. of 5/8” .=A0 The coil form was =
wrapped
with as many turns of AWG #36 as I could put on the form.=A0 Then, I =
located the
midpoint of the magnet assembly at the midpoint of the coil.=A0 Picture =
a donut
sliding along a broomstick. 

As I mentioned, I was just playing around when the idea =
came to
me.=A0 For those who aren’t familiar with Cow Magnets, farmers =
make their
cows swallow them so that any metal they ingest while grazing will stick =
to the
magnets and not perforate their innards.=A0 Here’s a link to the =
kind of
Cow Magnets I used: http://www.magnetsource.com/Solutions_Pages/cowmagsAlnicoPill.html=


 

Best regards,

Mike

 





From:=

psnlist-request@.............. [mailto:psnlist-request@............... =
On
Behalf Of Jim and Connie Lehman

Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 4:47 PM

To: psnlist@..............

Subject: Fw: Faraday's Law





 



 





-----
Original Message ----- 



From: Jim and Connie Lehman =






To: psn-l@..............






Sent:<=
/b> Wednesday, =
August
11, 2010 11:00 AM






Subject: Re: =
Faraday's Law







 





Mike--an
interesting question.  N & S poles spaced apart create a =
strong
straight geometry of lines of force between them.  N to N spaced =
apart
would show a "squished" field with lines of force leaving and =
bending
backward.  A coil placed in a N to N setting would show some =
output, but
nothing like the N to S.





 
Bear in mind, lines of force are fictitious but you get an idea of their
presence by placing a glass plate over N to S spaced closely, and =
sprinkling
iron filings over the area.  Do likewise with N to N, and you will =
see a
big difference.





  
In the typical Lehman coil/magnet arrangement the ideal is to place =
half the pickup =
coil in
the magnetic N to S gap so that the wires in that part of the coil are =
perpendicular to =
the
strong field lines.  Then any movement of coil or magnet will =
induce a
current output from the coil.





Keep
up the good work-Jim







-----
Original Message ----- 





From: Mike Lozano 





To: psn-l@..............






Sent:<=
/b> Monday, =
August 09,
2010 7:43 PM






Subject: RE: =
Faraday's Law





 



Hi everyone,

 

Here’s a question I’ve always wanted to =
ask: 
Why (if the number of magnetic lines of force cut per unit time produces =
a
current flow) is it not possible to force two identical magnets together =
so
that they’re oriented (for example) N pole to N pole.  It =
seems to
me that the lines of force would crowd together so that the least =
movement of
them would produce quite a strong response in a coil. =


 

I built a simple vertical seismometer with a 5 pound
plumber’s lead as the weight, a spring and two cow magnets forced
together in a tube of PVC so that the resting position in the coil was =
the
point at which the maximum lines of force resided.  It made a lot =
of sense
when I designed it but I didn’t have a good environment in which =
to test
it; e.g. A 500 foot TV station antenna within 50 feet; an expressway two =
blocks
away and a location inside a TV studio.  To be sure, it was a short =
period
sensor.  

 

I’m not a seismologist (that should be quite =
evident)
… I’m a retired electrical engineer who specialized in =
grounding
and lightning damage risk mitigation.  In case you’re =
wondering
about the TV station stuff, I made my living as a Meteorologist (my =
2nd
degree).  If my idea is dumb please excuse me – I was just =
very
curious about this and thought I’d write and =
ask.

 

Miguel Lozano

Lockhart, TX, USA

 





From:=
 =
psn-l-request@..............
[mailto:psn-l-request@............... On Behalf Of Ted =
Channel

Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 9:36 AM

To: psn

Subject: Faraday's Law





 



Hi
Folks,  I have used a simple tubular coil and ring magnet assm. in =
a
number of sensors.   Yet I still have unanswered questions =
about
Faraday's Law.





 





=
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/electric/farlaw.html =
 
I have never taken the time to test all the configurations, but now is a =
good
time.   Before I begin I wanted to ask someone, who understand =
it or
who actually has done these tests.





 





Here are=
 my
questions...............Looking at this wed page, there is a simple, =
tubular
coil.   The illustration shows only one pole of the magnet =
entering
the coil.   The formula and examples I believe I
understand.    However What happens, when both =
poles are
inside the coil, say a small ring magnet 1/4" =
thick.   Now
things are not clear.   Is there a cancelling =
effect?   
With both north and south poles inside the coil, I would think this =
would be
the case.    To keep this understandable, let's not =
consider any
magnets on the outside of the coil.





 





I
see these possibilities.  





1
One pole entering the coil, as shown, when it move in one direction it =
produces
+ voltage, when it move in the opposite direction, - voltage.  This =
is the
only arrangement I have used.





2.
Both poles inside the coil, when it move in one =
direction.........?  
When it moves in the opposite direction....?





3.
Two magnets, one entering and one exiting, with like poles facing each
other.   When they move, at the same time, in one
direction..........?  When they move, at the same time, in the =
other
direction?





4. 
Two magnets, one entering and one exiting, with opposite poles facing =
each
other.  When they move, at the same time, in one =
direction....?  When
they move, at the same time, in the other =
direction?





 





I
am going to run this simple test........but would like someone to =
explain,
before,  what I should see.





 





Thanks,





Ted